Dear D,
Thank you for visiting with me on Sunday. If you are willing, I hope to have you meet with my sons. All three can handle biblical questions. They are also Christians by faith, as are their children. They have had all of the questions you ask, given to them and maybe asked by them. Their education has only been secular. They have had no Christian education. They are strong-willed, but the fruit of the Spirit governs their lives. I do not expect their answers to convince you. I do expect you to see intelligent, educated people who do not close their eyes to problems, but are not skeptics.
You may also see why I gave up, many years ago, answering questions like yours.
It seems that you think your skepticism is a moral high ground. However, you have identified yourselves with many people who are not skeptics - they are dead sure of their positions. You do not seem to be skeptical of their absolute certainties. You may think that they have reasonable answers. If so, side with them in their certainties and cease being a skeptic. You haven’t done so, which may man you are hoping that there is truth over here. You want this truth to be established empirically in the same way the naturalist seeks to establish truth. It can be approached, but it cannot be done and should not be done. God decided not to do it that way. “For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God…For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know Him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.”
Here are three definitions of empiricism: 1) relying on experience or observation alone, often without due regard for system or theory; 2) originating in, or based on observation or experience; 3) capable of being verified or disproved by observation or experience.
In communicating with man, God used revelation: natural revelation and special revelation.
Natural Revelation:
Reason does not cause faith, even if all the reason points to the truth of the Gospel. There are many people who are convinced of the truth of the Gospel who are not Christians. I will be glad to introduce you to a few here in this community. “Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the preaching of Christ” (Rom. 10:17).
You mentioned that your moral and ethical standard was created by civilization, the reasonable outcome of caring for one another. When I mentioned Islam and Hinduism, you replied that that was religion. True enough, but those religions provide the culture for a third of the world. Atheism, Catholicism, and animism are religions that determine the moral standard for another third. If your ethical and moral standards come from society, it is the society of evangelical Christian northerners, specifically your mother and father.
Whatever the moral standards of whatever part of the world, the standard does not make people moral. It does two things: 1) It makes them conscious of their immorality. 2) It makes them immoral. “The (moral) law was given to increase the trespass. But where sin increased grace increased all the more” (Rom. 5:20). Societies with moral standards have no “forgiveness” in their societies or religions.
We are not imposing morality. We are offering forgiveness for known immoralities.
With love and respect,
Jim Wilson
Thank you for visiting with me on Sunday. If you are willing, I hope to have you meet with my sons. All three can handle biblical questions. They are also Christians by faith, as are their children. They have had all of the questions you ask, given to them and maybe asked by them. Their education has only been secular. They have had no Christian education. They are strong-willed, but the fruit of the Spirit governs their lives. I do not expect their answers to convince you. I do expect you to see intelligent, educated people who do not close their eyes to problems, but are not skeptics.
You may also see why I gave up, many years ago, answering questions like yours.
It seems that you think your skepticism is a moral high ground. However, you have identified yourselves with many people who are not skeptics - they are dead sure of their positions. You do not seem to be skeptical of their absolute certainties. You may think that they have reasonable answers. If so, side with them in their certainties and cease being a skeptic. You haven’t done so, which may man you are hoping that there is truth over here. You want this truth to be established empirically in the same way the naturalist seeks to establish truth. It can be approached, but it cannot be done and should not be done. God decided not to do it that way. “For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God…For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know Him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.”
Here are three definitions of empiricism: 1) relying on experience or observation alone, often without due regard for system or theory; 2) originating in, or based on observation or experience; 3) capable of being verified or disproved by observation or experience.
In communicating with man, God used revelation: natural revelation and special revelation.
Natural Revelation:
The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of His hands. Day unto day they pour four speech, night after night they display knowledge. There is no speech or language where their voice is not heard. Their voice has gone out into all the earth their words to the end of the world. (Ps. 19:1-4)Special Revelation:
The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men suppress the truth by their wickedness, since what may be known about God is plan to them. For since the creation of the world God’s invincible qualities – his eternal power and divine nature have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse. (Rom. 1:18-20)
The law of the LORD is perfect, reviving the soul. The statues of the LORD are trustworthy, making wise the simple. (Ps. 19:7)You can ignore observation of creation, you can ignore special revelation, you can ignore the experiences of others, and you can refuse your own experience. All of these decisions are foolish or unwise.
And He made know unto us the mystery of His will according to His good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ to be put into effect when the times will have reached their fulfillment – to bring all things in heaven and on earth together under one head, even Christ. (Eph. 1:9-10)
Acts 2: The apostles experiences of being filled with the Holy Spirit.
Acts 9: Saul’s conversion experience.
Currently, my experience and millions of others in this generation who have passed from death to life.
Reason does not cause faith, even if all the reason points to the truth of the Gospel. There are many people who are convinced of the truth of the Gospel who are not Christians. I will be glad to introduce you to a few here in this community. “Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the preaching of Christ” (Rom. 10:17).
You mentioned that your moral and ethical standard was created by civilization, the reasonable outcome of caring for one another. When I mentioned Islam and Hinduism, you replied that that was religion. True enough, but those religions provide the culture for a third of the world. Atheism, Catholicism, and animism are religions that determine the moral standard for another third. If your ethical and moral standards come from society, it is the society of evangelical Christian northerners, specifically your mother and father.
Whatever the moral standards of whatever part of the world, the standard does not make people moral. It does two things: 1) It makes them conscious of their immorality. 2) It makes them immoral. “The (moral) law was given to increase the trespass. But where sin increased grace increased all the more” (Rom. 5:20). Societies with moral standards have no “forgiveness” in their societies or religions.
We are not imposing morality. We are offering forgiveness for known immoralities.
With love and respect,
Jim Wilson
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